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Abstract This article responds to Robert C. Allen’s reply to my new wage evidence for London, 1650-1800. The day rates Allen relies upon are not ‘wages’, and the evidence clearly points to a large difference between existing estimates and actual wages earned. His use of the piece rate in understanding earnings is significant, but cannot support a ‘high wage’ thesis. International comparisons that take new evidence into account do not show English wages to be any higher than elsewhere in Europe.